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[Trump thread]The worst day in Western history since Adolf Hitler


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#101
shelly

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Trump is bad. But so is Hillary. Voting turnout in 2016 was all-time low. People just didn't show up to vote, so it made it seemed like the racists/bigots turned out to vote. There was really no viable choice because people don't vote third party. I don't know why? Maybe Americans watch too much football and can only think of the world between two teams, between God and Satan, between good and evil. And it is standard divide and conqueror tactics. 

[...]

 

People don't vote third party because we know it is useless, not because of the beliefs you listed.



#102
Feishy Bit Moar

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Well in that case, at least go to the polls and cast and empty ballot. That's what the French did. 


Muricans are too lazy, they just sit on their coach and watch TV.



#103
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someone should write a story about the fired FBI directory. It's like the perfect hollywood movie. has all the elements of a Greek tragedy



#104
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Ima HiJack this thread with a message from Ron Paul.

 

"Fire the FBI" - Ron Paul. 

 

We don't have capitalism, we have corporatism.

 

Taxation is Theft.

 

Individual Liberty is freedom.

 

Stop wars we don't need and get out of conflicts we don't belong in, we just prolong wars/conflicts.

 

Gold is true currency with intrinsic value.

 

End the Fed.


Edited by Jyat, 11 May 2017 - 08:19 PM.

"The Light Doesn't Suit You"  Yes I have my D out for Harambe. 

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#105
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Libertarians are Anarchists with money.   (Said to me by an old-time Texas Democrat, in the early 1980s.)


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#106
Jyat

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A response from a liberal/socialist always starts off with name calling or slang. I'm not a libertarian, parties are against the true creation of the US. The US constitution and the founding fathers are anti-government, since they know what governments are capable of. Of course they knew the US government would degenerate into a taxation monster as the British government they fought before hand. Holding the constitution over all is necessary to hold individual freedom to the highest.

 

There's nothing wrong with being an anarchist, unless you're an anarcho-communist, thats just a big contradiction, two different sides of the spectrum or known as Bolshevism. Also, the libertarians don't like fiat currency. Gold is real-honest currency with intrinsic value. Gold is able to hold long periods of stability. Only reason governments try to impose fiat currency is that it gives more power to politicians for them to manipulate prices and markets. I invite you to read The War on Gold by Antony C Sutton.

 

How you responded to me helps me identify who you are. I bet you believe in something as absurd as "hate speech." Sorry sir, you have the right to be offended, not the right to be not offended. From your previous posts I believe you are a democratic socialist? Ah yes, Bolsheviks were democratic socialists, but when they got full power of the government the converted to communism. I simply cannot understand why democrats such as yourself hold Ancient Athens so highly. Athenian Pure Democracy is a large part of the downfall of Athens. Democracies fall because people realize they can vote for what they want rather than earn it. Long live the Constitutional Republic, and restore the purity of the Constitution. 


Edited by Jyat, 12 May 2017 - 11:14 PM.

"The Light Doesn't Suit You"  Yes I have my D out for Harambe. 

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#107
Natureboy

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I guess even an old joke sounds like name calling if your skin is thin enough.

 

Re hate speech: There's something known as incitement to violence. Also bullying based on ethnic/religious/gender/sexual orientation can create a hostile work environment. Those are specific cases of known limits to free speech. The first is similar to the "crying 'Fire!' in a crowded theater' exception. The second is because the victim cannot escape the offensive speech without significant economic/intangible losses. 

 

In the public space or in private debate, I will staunchly defend your right to speech that offends me. On the other hand, I don't owe you either my time nor a portion of my (shared) resources to promote something I find abhorrent.  Rather I have a civic obligation to assert what's wrong with those views. Discrediting faulty/impractical ideas is a cherished outcome of the exercise of free speech. Crying "unfair, you're suppressing my views!" is a rather weak rhetorical response to losing an argument. That said, because there's been so much blurring of the lines between public and private spaces, it seems a lot of people today are vague about just where their rights to free speech are guaranteed.

 

 

 

Have fun pigeonholing my politics. I'm an old hippie who found the "new left" both annoyingly dogmatic and impractical as a political movement in a pluralistic society. Eventually I let myself be co-opted by the value system intrinsic in academic research (". . . and love of unseen things that do not die.") Couldn't entirely stomach the self-promotion necessary for advancement at a research university, so went to work for a national lab where I could work more in teams and 'make a difference' by inventing new tools to model and measure the functioning and health of the biosphere.


Edited by Natureboy, 14 May 2017 - 07:23 AM.

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#108
Horn

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THE PRESIDENT WROTE A TWEET THAT CONTAINED A TYPO, REVEALING THAT HE'S IMPERFECT. EVERYBODY FREAK THE F%#K OUT.

I apologize. Honestly. I just had to get that out of me. Please delete this post if it's improper.

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#109
wife in training

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My favorite thing lately is propaganda.  I think this is an important subject considering all of the "fake news" is being spouted by both sides of the political spectrum.  I learned that communism was created by Jewish people (Karl Marx, Lenin)  and that it's believed by many that communism is basically Judaism!  (I believe this may be perceived by people as anti-semite - ironically I have learned that the term anti-semite is propaganda lol)  I bring up communism and their blood because they are the biggest proponents for propaganda.  Next it should be pretty obvious ( I think? ) that the media has taken up the role on telling us how to feel about things instead of giving us unbiased news.   CNN is really bad about this and if you look at the staff...  nearly almost everyone of them are Jewish.  I can't make this up http://i.imgur.com/Ja4Py1z.jpg. Again I am not trying to be hateful towards Jewish people I just like doing research and it is just falling into place the more I do. I can't stress this enough.  People are so sensitive in todays political climate.

 

Propaganda from this book I was reading can be in the form of "power" words (anti-Semite, racism, homophobia, Islamophobia are notable mentions),  slogans, catch phrases, etc!  They are used to fully convince the user and to give them an argument (even if they technically have no argument).  One example I can think of is the propaganda word racism.  I saw an article by a SJW saying how someone can't be racist towards white people.  Because they're privileged or something (racism as far as I know is supposed to mean hatred towards someone over their skin color).  They were using a term I haven't heard of before called reverse-racism.  Anyways back in the early 1900s no one used the word racist/racism instead they used the word prejudice which basically means that you stereotype someone without facts.  I would really like these people to try to paint white people in the same way without the word racism and try to explain their position with that word and see what they can come up with.  Cause as it seems to me right now that SJW in this case was using the word as an argument when they really didn't have an argument at all!  They were hating a person of a specific color.  But because they hate them, it doesn't count as racism.  That is extremely prejudice.

 

I mean I hope most people can understand how asinine such a thought pattern is but this was an extreme example I was using. 

 

Propaganda is really complex and fun to learn about and I hope others would pursue it too because it will protect yourself from it. 


Edited by wife in training, 04 June 2017 - 06:30 PM.


#110
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Calling Lenin Jewish, because he had a Jewish-born maternal grandfather, is a bit of stretch.  Tzarist Russia had a lot of anti-Jewish prejudice, going back centuries. Then during the Russian civil war, White Russians claimed that the revolution was a Jewish plot against traditional Russians. That helped build opposition to the reds and prolonged the civil war. Lenin was a dogmatic atheist.  Trotsky was born into a (non-religious) Jewish family, but renounced his heritage. Anyway Hitler revived claims about Judeo-Bolshevik linkages as part of his justification for invading Russia.

 

The twentieth century saw so much truly vile propaganda written about Jews that it remains very important to check your sources (and their sources).  There's a deep, wide river of lies to draw from.  As to why we should care, there's the problem that roughly half the ~12 million civilians deliberately killed by the Nazi government were killed because they were identified as Jewish. Of course other fascist and client/subject governments in Europe cooperated with the Germans in carrying out the slaughter. That doesn't justify every Zionist action since then, but does help explain why a "Jewish homeland" in Europe was not attractive prospect. At least Islam had (until then) a history of tolerating minorities who were other peoples "of the book" (Abrahamic religions).


Edited by Natureboy, 06 June 2017 - 08:19 PM.

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#111
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I guess even an old joke sounds like name calling if your skin is thin enough.

I can't even sit down and have a valid debate anymore without someone spewing unneeded dialogue. Just getting sick and tired of it. This election was fun with memes but really annoying as both sides had terrible arguments and just mudslinged to a new level. Especially how it releases my inner troll.

 

 Propaganda is really complex and fun to learn about and I hope others would pursue it too because it will protect yourself from it. 

 

Well it goes deeper than just the 'Jew' concept. Yes a Jew owns the Red Shield bank. Yes by blood or ancestry religion was Jewish. But Trotsky lived in New York for a time and was taken care of by WallStreet. Lenin was trained by Jesuits in Geneva. Stalin also grew up in a Catholic family. Ford was part of the funding for Hitler. US didn't bomb certain factories in Germany that could have let the war end quicker. So you did point out that Jews do have a tendency to be part of the bad mob, but so do the Catholics. Vatican was part of the Serbian genocide. Lots of stuff going on that you can't have a simple answer as to "those damn jews." I especially love those guys who call themselves 'Red Pill.' They have only hit the branches and not the trunk.

 

The most interesting part was why would America allow to sell nuclear chips/ICUs to the Soviet Union? The Soviets wouldn't have nuclear weapons or would have taken longer to create the nuclear computers. Then you go back to the Russian Revolution which has evidence suggesting the revolution was western backed and US troops were actually in Russia at the time to apparently "keep violence to a minimum until the Russians stopped the rebellion." 

 

So you tell me? Is the answer simple or complex? I see multiple culprits, not just one. 


"The Light Doesn't Suit You"  Yes I have my D out for Harambe. 

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#112
Natureboy

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Ummm.  History of computing: the transistor wasn't invented until the late 1940s and integrated circuits date to ~1959. Computers in the 1940s used mostly vacuum tubes (or "valves" in Brit-speak). Computers in the 1950s used discrete components, individually soldered, whether based on vacuum tubes, mechanical relays, voltage gated transistors, or mix of the three.

 

The Russians already had a working atom bomb by late 1949, built using analog technology.  (They did have some help from data gathered by spies embedded in the Manhattan Project.) Nuclear chips/integrated control circuits weren't even developed until more than a decade later. The causal link you propose is historically impossible.  

 

The role of (then classified) computer technology used by the Allies in World War II has been well documented from declassified archives. Most of the focus was code-breaking. Whereas bomb-related math was mostly done with paper, pencil, chalk and slide rules. This is a matter for professional historians with access to those primary sources, so there's really not much room left for the wilder tin-foil-hat theories from the 1950s and 1960s.


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#113
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From what I've heard, when Hilary was secretary of state, she approved the sales of nuclear fuel to Russians. I think Americans in general are very pragmatic. In that sense we are very similar to the British and the Dutch. During the Spanish inquisition that drove out the Jews from Spain (and practically everywhere else in Europe), the Dutch welcomed the Jewish merchants with open arms. That's one of the reason that the Dutch became so wealthy and had an early start in the global colonization game. To this day, much of American insurance is based on mercantile insurance of early American shippers, which is based on the model the Dutch shippers used. The British too are very pragmatic. Seeing what the Dutch did, and what made the Dutch prosperous, they allowed the Jews to come into their country, against a lot of protests of local Protestant merchants who feared increased competition. But ultimately the absorption of the Jews made Britain very wealthy, and very formidable, especially in international finance. So, there is that inherent tension, I think, between utility and dogmatism, between money and faith. 



#114
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I haven't talked about the subject of nuclear arms for a few years so my information  might be off. The technology the US sold might have been for long range nuclear 60-80's missiles. Definitely not used for the Atom bombs. Possibly hydrogen bombs. I'ma have to reread the books I've read. It might have been a missile control system rather than individual computers.

 

edit: I was able to find it http://www.heritage.org/homeland-security/report/the-strategic-dimensions-the-us-computer-exports-the-ussr

 

 

@Felshy Bit Moar

 

Many of these countries become wealthy by war. Just like the US is right now. You have people financing both sides of wars. Conflict creates innovation, exactly why Europe became the most advanced modern continent. Constant fighting between small nations and the need for innovation. The western europeans are more advanced because of this. The eastern europeans have had less conflict than the westerners overall.


Edited by Jyat, 09 June 2017 - 09:34 PM.

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#115
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U.S. export controls are complicated when it come to IT systems. Initially most computers were for business use. Then (in the WWII time-frame) the military applications became important. For a while, military and space program requirements drove innovation in IT performance and packaging, with most of the work in the U.S. done by private government contractors or on research grants, rather than civil servants.  Still competition to meet government requirements tended to drive technical performance, and the underlying fundamental research was as much from DARPA funding, NASA, NSF, etc. as from direct corporate investment in big corporate research labs (e.g., Bell Labs, Xerox PARC, IBM & HP research labs).  Export control regs. were then written assuming that aerospace IT would be cutting edge.

 

After the introduction of the Apple II (and other consumer/hobbyist systems like the Osbourne), things began to change. Unexpected markets developed. Workstations (Sun, Apollo, HP, etc.) began mass roll-outs of systems with processors optimized for a reduced instruction set computing (RISC).  Soon workstations sold for non-classified applications were running rings around pricey mini-computers and commodity business mainframes. There was renaissance in new technology coming out corporate research labs (without government funding). The pace of change became such that by the time cumbersome military/aerospace procurement completed a purchase, the products delivered were already obsolete. (A NASA procurement program with rolling upgrades, SEWP, actually became the go to place for federal researchers to buy state-of-the-art hardware while still following US government procurement regs.)  A foreign adversary might buy a non-military workstation (sold for financial services, for example) that could easily be converted to defense use AND run faster than the mil-spec. hardware in use by defense establishments in the Western Alliance. That put export control for "dual use" IT in a genuine no-win situation. Clamp down hard and the technology would just move elsewhere, putting US producers and military buyers at a serious competitive disadvantage.

 

Finally as the market for personal computers grew into sales of hundreds of millions of units, Moore's Law came to consumer commodity IT systems.  As the feature size of processors and memory became smaller and smaller, the costs of a plant to produce them (fabs) grew almost as fast.  Eventually, fabs became so expensive that specialized military and aerospace processors were priced out of the market for production lines with the smallest feature sizes. Only chips with consumer-sized potential markets could justify the frequent >$10 billion investments in upgraded fabrication lines. Server farms, built with (mostly) consumer hardware, came to out-perform purpose-design supercomputer hardware for all but a handful of specialized applications.

 

Many of the smaller chip factories closed, and small-market military and aerospace needs ended up being kind of ghetto for old, slow, fault-tolerant, and electromagnetic pulse resistant technology.  At this point, there's still some specialized embedded control/guidance hardware that's worth doing export control. Much of the effort in the last decade or two has focused instead on controlling export of software with military applications. That said, the computer in your new smart phone, selling a ~billion units is now faster than anything used for defense purposes during the Cold War. Not to mention: most of the fastest and most energy efficient processors and memory chips are produced in China or Taiwan. 

 

 


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